Program Item Details
TITLE: Dr. John Vidmar, Alberta Research Council
SUBJECT: #256 Algae to Capture Carbon Dioxide and Produce Bio-Diesel
SYNOPSIS: The green scum that covers our lakes in summer may soon become Mother Nature’s prodigal son. Scientists at the Alberta Research Council and other organizations within Innoventures Canada believe they can use algae to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere--and produce biodiesel.prodigal son.
Dr. John Vidmar explains.
AUDIO: Download Audio (mp3 format)
TRANSCRIPT:
#256 April 26, 2008
Interview starts at 1:11
Intro: The scum of the earth may soon turn out to be its savior--pond scum, that is. The lowly algae. That’s the hope of scientists working with Innoventures Canada, a consortium of research councils across the country.
One of those scientists is Dr. John Vidmar, program leader for Bio Resource Technologies at the Alberta Research Council.
JV: Well we’re looking at algae as a mechanism or the use of algae to capture CO2 and make biodiesel and other added value products. Canada produces quite a bit of CO2. We do have a lot of point sources where we have concentrated CO2.
Now the question is, can we grow algae fast enough and that has a good profile for these added value uses, high fatty acids for biodiesel, in an economic way.
CC: BUT WHY ALGAE? WHAT MAKES IT A CANDIDATE FOR THIS SORT OF WORK?
JV: If you start looking at our agricultural lands in Alberta or in Canada, we don’t want to take those lands away from food production because food is always going to be important to us. So when you start looking at growing algae in large ponds, hectare sizes, you don’t want to be using prime agricultural land.
And also, the productivity. On our initial calculations, we think we can get probably up to about 5 to 10 times more biodiesel in the same amount of space as we would from canola.
CC: WHERE THEN DOES ALGAE FIT IN THE CARBON CYCLE? BECAUSE IT MUST BE TAKING IN CARBON THEN. HOW DOES THAT ACTUALLY WORK?
JV: Well as a green organism, it has a photosynthetic apparatus. So CO2 is transported into the cell and then it gets converted or fixed to carbohydrates and then other pathways within it will convert it to sugars, to fatty acids, to the backbones of proteins, that type of situation.
CC: WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO DO THEN TO MAKE THE ALGAE WORK ON A SCALE THAT’S GOING TO ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING IN TERMS OF CAPTURING CARBON OR PRODUCING BIODIESEL?
JV: It’s actually increasing their growth rates. We’re not trying to change the algae, we’re trying to look for the right algae that has a fast growth rate and also has a nice oil profile for the production of biodiesel.
CC: SO IN TERMS OF STRAINS, WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT? WHAT’S THE RIGHT ALGAE?
JV: Uh, well, you know this project started about six months ago and we’re on the initial part of this. So we’ve actually gone to a number of different sites in Saskatchewan next to coal plants and actually sampled and we’re currently, those samples were enriched in Saskatchewan at the SRC (Saskatchewan Research Council).
Then the samples actually went to Quebec where we’ve done purification of the strains. And now we’re looking at the growth rates to see if there are ones that are good candidates within this.
CC: SO THEN ARE THESE ESSENTIALLY LIKE ALGAE, THE POND SCUM, THAT WE FIND ON ALL THOSE LITTLE SLOUGHS AROUND ALBERTA?
JV: Exactly. You know, when you start looking at what’s available from other scientists, most of the algae, micro-algae availability is tropical algaes or algaes that won’t suit the temperatures that we’re looking at growing these at. We’re looking at 14 degrees because we know a lot of power plants, they have excess heat, they use cooling ponds. So we’re looking for something that has good productivity around 14 degrees. And will live in our climate.
CC: WHAT ARE THE TECHNICAL CHALLENGES THAT YOU’RE DEALING WITH NOW? WHAT ARE YOU DOING IN THE LAB?
JV: Right now, we’re trying to identify and we’re looking at the growth rates and actually the fatty acid profiles or the end carbohydrates and also the protein, to see how these micro-algae are actually separating their carbon. Where are they putting their carbon. Because we want ones that have in excess of 50 percent fatty acids.
That’s what we’re currently doing right now. It’s very preliminary at this stage. But you know, there’s been a lot of work done all over the world on this. And there’s a number of actual engineering issues. When you’re looking at all this algae being grown in liquid. How do you separate it? Then how do you process the algae to get your oil out of it because it’s a very watery-type solution with some algae in it. So those are some of the questions we’re looking at.
And then from this algae, how do we process it to make biodiesel.
CC: SO IS THAT WHERE THE FATTY ACIDS COME IN?
JV: Yes, the fatty acids are the backbones which then get converted through a number of chemical processes to produce biodiesel.
CC: WHEN IT COMES TO THE POINT WHERE YOU’D ACTUALLY HAVE THESE LITTLE ALGAE FACTORIES AROUND THE COUNTRY, IS IT GOING TO BE AN OUTSIDE THING OR IS THIS SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE DONE INSIDE IN A FACTORY? HOW WOULD IT WORK? ARE WE GOING TO HAVE PONDS EVERYWHERE?
JV: Well the thing is, there’s a number of different technologies out there. The initial work done in the US by the DOE used these open ponds systems in which evaporation is a problem. And you also have very little control.
The major push going on in the States and around world are these bio-reactors. Different bio-reactors in which you basically grow algae. But then the cost becomes too high because you have all this infrastructure going in.
So, we’re actually looking at a hybrid of these. Covered ponds in which we have control, a lot more control on evaporation and temperature. Also the depth of the ponds. If you’re looking at a pond, the first two inches is the only place where you actually have your algae within it. Underneath that there’s no algae being grown because light isn’t getting there.
So we’re looking at solar collectors and actually trying to increase the depth of the pond where we have active growth of the algae. And that’s being handled in Manitoba. We have a researcher there who is looking at lighting options and solar collectors.
Because, you know, when you start looking at the magnitude of this, the amount of CO2 we produce, if we can only get growth in the first 10 cm of our ponds, we’re going have all these massive ponds where we only have that ability of looking at a 2-dimensional system. So one of the ideas was actually changing that and bringing it into a 3-dimensional system in which we can get the light deeper into the ponds and therefore, have deeper ponds and hence more productivity.
CC: SO IS IT BASED JUST ON SUNLIGHT? OR WOULD YOU HAVE TO USE ADDITIONAL LIGHT?
JV: We’re calculating that. We don’t have, if you start looking at Alberta, we get good light for six months of the year and then we become light limited when winter comes. So the question is, by adding additional light, artificial light, do we capture the productivity that we need for the biodiesel? And that’s one of the questions we’re asking. And hopefully we’ll have an answer soon.
CC: I KNOW WE HAVE SEASONAL LIGHT, BUT DO WE GET ENOUGH LIGHT DURING THAT TIME? DOES IT MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF THERE’S DIRECT SUNLIGHT OR INDIRECT LIGHT?
JV: Well, one of the things is that at noon time, if you look at most plants, they’ve actually shut off most of their photosynthetic activity because of that direct sunlight. There’s a thing called photo inhibition, in which too many photons actually are hitting the photosynthetic apparati, the antennae. And therefore they have to shuffle it. And they basically shutdown photosynthesis.
And this happens in a lot of tropical countries. One of the advantages we have in Alberta or in Canada, is actually a lot of our light is not direct sunlight. It’s always at an angle because of the latitude that we live at. There is that advantage.
The other thing is that if you start looking at the amount of light we get in Alberta--I’ll use Alberta as a specific case, during the whole year, we’re actually doing very, very well. So those are some of the advantages.
The disadvantage is the temperature. So a lot of coalfired plants actually have excess heat. Can we trap that heat and use that to warm our pools.
The other option is geo-thermal heating or solar heating. So there are a number of different options here. And we’re trying to integrate this to make it work.
Ten years ago, you know we were looking at $10 a barrel for oil. Now we’re looking at $100 a barrel for oil. So a lot of things that weren’t economically feasible, you know, that balance changes. And the other thing is that it’s a win situation. We’re capturing CO2. We’re producing a renewable energy source. Like solar power, you have solar panels. Well you have to think of this pond scum as actual solar panels. They’re taking up the sun and they’re producing an energy source.
CC: WHAT DO YOU THINK THE POTENTIAL IS THEN FOR OFFSETTING WHAT WE’RE DOING NOW? IS IT GOING TO BE A SMALL PERCENTAGE OR A LARGE?
JV: It really, it really depends. As a scientist I don’t know what the answer is. There’s a number of different technologies out there, from capturing, from using trees as fuels. There are so many things.
I think that every little solution we have helps the situation. It’s like there is going to be no silver bullet for this. Hopefully silver buckshot.
CC: WHAT DO YOU LIKE ABOUT THIS?
JV: The thing that really interests me is that I have the ability to make a difference. And that’s one thing as a scientist, you want to make a difference. You want to help society. That’s my major goal out of this.
CC: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, JOHN.
JV: Thank you.
Dr. John Vidmar is program leader for Bio Resource Technologies at the Alberta Research Council. ARC is a founding member of I-Can or Innoventures Canada, a consortium of research councils across the country.
FEATURED LINK: Alberta Reserch Council